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TurtleCoin® v2 FAQ

The community submitted questions about v2 and we’re answering them as they come in.

The community sent in questions and we’re here to answer some of the most popular ones. We’ll try to keep the answers straight and to the point wherever possible. 

This article is living and breathing and additional topics may be added as they come in. This permalink is the best way to always link to the latest version of this article.

Note: Some questions may be paraphrased from the questions submitted by the community to help avoid ambiguity in duplicate questions.

Q) What is TurtleCoin® v2?

Put simply, v2 is the next generation of the the TurtleCoin® project. Out with the old and in with the new as they say. The v1 network served us well, but as time has passed we want to do more, and to do that best, we need a clean slate. By starting a new network from scratch, we are able to make much bigger improvements without worrying about being backwards compatible with previous history.

For more information, we suggest reading TRTL v2 and TurtleCoin® v2 Overview as well as other blog articles as they are produced.

Q) When will v2 be released?

We’re aiming for before block 4,000,000 of the v1 chain. The actual date is fuzzy at this time but as we get closer to a release date more information will be made available.

Q) Where is the v2 whitepaper?

We gave ourselves a short deadline to come up with v2 software, so for now we are focusing on writing that first, with a whitepaper coming soon after.

If you’re looking for write-ups on what we’re doing as we are doing it, check out the blog articles for the latest and greatest about TRTLv2.

Q) Are you planning to have an audit performed?

We very likely won’t pay for an audit like other projects and instead are working with volunteers in their respective areas to provide feedback and guidance on our implemenation of the cryptographic primitives used in v2. We are also keeping a close eye on the audits performed on other implemenations that may provide insight or changes in how we have implemented the cryptographic concepts.

We encourage everyone to take a look at the cryptographic code that’s being used in v2. It is currently available in the turtlecoin-crypto repository. If you have questions, comments, or suggestions, simply open an issue on that repo.

Q) What are the biggest enhancements or benefits of v2 that we can look forward to?

  • New Core software, written from scratch, in-house.
  • Delegated Proof of Stake
    • No more mining blocks which enables faster settlement of transactions that is backed by users staking nodes as producers and verifiers of transactions and blockchain data.
    • The delegated portion of this means that users vote for producers and validators by staking funds instead of all producers and validators being predetermined.
  • Staking
    • Enables every user who wishes to stake a chance to win block rewards by helping to secure the network
  • Bulletproofs+
    • Range proofs enabling masked amounts which reduces the occurrence of dust on the chain.
  • CLSAG and maybe Triptych
    • Faster transaction signature verification with larger anonymity sets
  • Transaction Pruning
    • Less chain bloat means a smaller chain and lower storage requirements for operating a node
  • No Block Intervals
    • Blocks are only created when there are transactions to be processed, there will be no empty blocks.

All of these changes allow the network to be even more stable, fast, and easy to transact with. The chain will be smaller, faster, and easier to sync than v1. The network will move faster, transactions will move faster, and we’ll see significantly lower transaction fees.

For more information, we suggest reading TRTL v2 and TurtleCoin® v2 Overview as well as other blog articles as they are produced.

Q) Faster transactions and pruning? How might these changes apply to applications that are built on TRTL?

Due to the overzealous use of extra data in transactions in the past and a lack of the fee-per-byte structure we had to implement a maximum to the amount of arbitrary data you could put in each transaction. This was to prevent attacks on the network caused by the propagation of bloated data for the low low price of 0.10 TRTL (the network fee at the time).

The extra space had valid uses for things such as payment IDs, transaction public keys, and a few other pieces of necessary information. This same space could be used to load arbitrary data such as messages, files, and other bits into the transaction as well. However, with a maximum of 1,024 bytes (1KB) developers have to get very creative in how they store data on chain.

The significant reduction in transaction sizes in v2 coupled with the changes to transaction structures and a fee-per-byte model incorporated at chain launch will allow us to open up the maximum amount of space that can be used to carry arbitrary data on chain. This will enable developers to leverage the chain in new ways and we’re excited to see what people come up with.

Q) What will be the minimum amount required to stake?

We haven’t settled on the required amount to propose a new candidate node into the network just yet. While we want anyone to be able to run a candidate node in v2 we have to make sure that there is sufficient “skin in the game” to ensure the success of the network. You’ll be required to “lock up” your stake to be a candidate node for a minimum amount of time.

As for users staking (“voting”) for a candidate node, 1 TRTL = 1 vote. You’ll need to stake whole TRTL coins to cast a vote. Like the stakes for candidate nodes, you’ll be required to stake your funds for a minimum amount of time before they can be recalled.

In any event, you’ll want to vote for trustworthy nodes that do their job in securing the network otherwise it puts your funds at risk.

Q) Does DPoS mean that TRTL is becoming a governance token?

TRTL isn’t a token. It’s a currency, an asset, a network, not a token riding on another chain.

TRTL’s take on DPoS uses PoS as a facility to put skin in the game to produce and validate blocks and gives normal users a chance to get a portion of each block reward. It’s far less about governance in the sense of voting for protocols and more about maintaining consensus and keeping the chain moving in an agreeable way.

Q) Is TurtleCoin® v2 focused on privacy?

Privacy is a beneficial side effect of some of the technologies that will be used such as CLSAG, possibly Triptych, Bulletproofs+, and Pedersen Commitments though it isn’t a specific goal we had from the beginning. All of these technologies are being adopted to reduce transaction sizes, speed up transaction verifications, and reduce network overhead thereby allowing for a much high transaction volume through the network. Those improvements happen to come with the bonus of a high level of privacy. 

As technologies such as CLSAG and Triptych allow us to have smaller signature sizes and have lower verification times – why not crank it up to 11 and enable massive ring sizes. Sure, this increases privacy on the network but that’s enabled by the changes we’re making to make the chain smaller, faster, better, and stronger.

Q) Why is the total supply changing from 1,000,000,000,000.00?

Right now, to buy a sandwich, you’d spend about half a million TurtleCoin. 500,000 can be made up of a LOT of inputs, and in our current way of making transactions, each of those inputs has a lot of signatures attached to it, which means fat transactions and big fees. That can’t be realistic. This would mean TRTL is near useless as a currency if you can’t even buy lunch with it.

In a nutshell, we call this dust. There are over 100,000,000 outputs on the v1 chain right now and most of those are dust. Seriously, go check it out on the mixable amounts page of the explorer. Over 10% of the outputs on the network are worth 0.01 TRTL today. We need to avoid this like the plague in v2. Moving to pedersen commitments and amount masking helps a lot in v2 and saying “1 trillion TRTL” was fun and all – but we really don’t need this baggage going into the overhaul, do we?

Q) So the total supply will be 10,000,000 TRTL in v2?

Not quite. The relation to 10M TRTL in v2 was to give people an idea of what the reduction via the swap will look like. In actuality, there is no cap to the total supply in v2. Hold on, put down the pitchfork, we’ll explain.

Right now, we estimate that the circulating supply of TRTL v1 at block 5,000,000 (when the chain ends) will be around 120,000,000,000 TRTL when accounting for the ramp down of the v1 chain. At the swap ratio of 100,000:1, this means that approximately 1,200,000 TRTL will be pre-mined on the v2 chain to fund the swap process (details below).

After that pre-mine, emission mechanics will be driven by use of the network. Block rewards will be granted at a 1:1 ratio of the full value of the transactions contained in the block in a fee-per-byte manner. This means that if a block contains transactions with a total of 1,000 TRTL in transaction fees, the base block reward will be 1,000 TRTL and the total block reward will be 2,000 TRTL.

Blocks will only be created when there are transactions to process so emission will be tied directly to the use of the network with no upper limit. The more the network is used, the more that is released into the circulating supply.

Q) Why will v2 only have two decimals?

Two decimals works at this point and helps keep dust in check. More than two decimals is confusing in many ways and makes it very hard to understand how much you are really sending in a transaction.

Q) How will the v1 to v2 transition work exactly? What happens to my current coins?

The transition period will last 1,000,000 blocks (or about a year), during that time you will use a website to generate an address unique to you where you can send your old coins, and you’ll be able to specify your new wallet address to receive your new coins. If you do nothing, your coins will eventually be burned after the swap has concluded.

When the service sees that the funds were indeed sent on the v1 chain and enough confirmations have passed (TBD, but likely 120 blocks), the service will submit a transaction on the v2 network that will send you the proper number of v2 coins to the v2 wallet address you supply the site. As mentioned previously, the swap will be at a rate of 100,000:1 meaning for every 1,000 v1 TRTL you send in via the swap service, you will receive 0.01 v2 TRTL.

Yes, it’s really that simple. TurtlePay® makes this easy.

Q) Do I have to do anything with my wallet(s) right now?

Find your seed phrase, and write it down. The swap period won’t start until block 4,000,000 but when it happens you’ll want quick access to your coins, including any time to sync.

Sit tight for now and we’ll provide directions on how to interact with the swap service when it’s ready and the swap window is open.

Seriously, sit tight, keep your v1 wallet synced, and be ready when the announcement(s) for the swap go out.

Tip: If you absolutely want to be notified when the swap happens, go in the discord chat and type *news which should apply a role that gets a notification any time we post v2 updates.

Q) If I have 1,000,000 coins in v1, how many coins will I have in v2?

The swap will be at a rate of 100,000:1 meaning for every 1,000 v1 TRTL you send in via the swap service, you will receive 0.01 v2 TRTL.

1,000,000 / 100,000 = 10. You’ll have 10.00 coins in v2.

Q) Do I have to change to the GUI wallet?

Nope. The core suite software will always include a CLI software wallet implementation. Use of a GUI wallet is optional and up to you.

Q) I used to mine TRTL but now I cannot open my wallet. Did I miss the upgrade to v2?

No, you didn’t miss the upgrade to v2, but you very likely missed numerous releases on the way to v1.0.0.

You’re going to need to grab yourself a copy of v0.28.3 and upgrade your wallet to the latest format.

Then you can open your wallet with the latest release and proceed with syncing your wallet. Backup your keys while you’re at it as you’re going to need them.

Q) What will be the ticker for TurtleCoin® v2?

v2 will completely replace the v1 chain and v1 will be retired. The ticker will remain TRTL.

Q) Are you going to get TRTL listed on more/bigger exchanges?

As developers, we focus on code and the reliability of the network. If the community finds an exchange that wants to list us, we are happy to assist them with engineering-level questions they may have about implementing TRTL, but other than that, we don’t go endorsing exchanges, engaging in partnerships, or paying for listings.

Q) I have v1 coins on “X” exchange and they are down for maintenance – can you advise when this will be fixed?

Ask that exchange why they haven’t jumped in the chat through matrix or discord and asked for help. We are happy to help with engineering questions, always.

As always, please remember, if your coins aren’t in a wallet with keys you control, they’re not your coins. This will be even more important as staking begins on the network, as you’d be forfeiting any ability to stake your own coins or get the benefits from doing so.

Q) Should I buy v1 coins before the swap?

Buy comfy sweatpants, ice cream, and maybe some whiteclaw. That’s the best advice we can give.

We aren’t investment advisors nor do we play one on the Internet. We can’t give you investment advice and never will. Your best bet is to do your own research, make your own decisions, and consult with a financial advisor on any financial decisions you may make.

Q) Will you re-evaluate the conversion (swap) rate if the value of TurtleCoin v1 climbs?

Nope, sorry, ain’t gonna happen, no. We have said it before and we will say it again. The swap rate is based on nothing but technical/engineering details and the impact of such on chain growth and bloat. It has nothing to do with “value”, “profit”, “gains”, and etc. If you have technical/engineering reasoning on why you think a different swap rate makes more sense, let us know.

Q) What are you doing about marketing efforts?

We’re trying to be more active on social media platforms like Twitter, Reddit, and countless other mediums but it’s largely a volunteer driven effort with it’s focus on getting the word out about v2. If you’ve got an idea join the discussion and maybe others will help you drive an effort.

Keep in mind that we’re developers that are allergic to suits, PowerPoint presentations, and sunlight so our social skills aren’t exactly aligned with marketing.

Q) Don’t remove PoW for the love of god.

Mistakes were made and we are fixing those mistakes by removing PoW from the mining of blocks. Also, that wasn’t a question.

Q) What is it good for? What is it’s utility?

TurtleCoin aims to be a fun, fast, and easy way to send funds between family, friends, and organizations. That’s the primary driving force behind the project – beyond that, it’s basically a choose your own adventure story. What do you want to use TurtleCoin for?

Q) Can I still mine TRTL once the v2 swap period has begun until the v1 chain stops?

Yes, the v1 chain will remain mineable for about 1,000,000 blocks once the swap period starts. Mining will end completely on the v1 chain by block 5,000,000 as the chain will end. The v1 chain will remain mineable until that block to facilitate the transfer of v1 funds to the burn address provided via the swap site so that you can receive your v2 funds.

Q) What is the website we need to use for converting v1 coins to v2 coins?

The website has not been launched yet and the URL is to be determined.

Sit tight for now and we’ll provide directions on how to interact with the swap service when it’s ready and the swap window is open.

Seriously, sit tight, keep your v1 wallet synced, and be ready when the announcement(s) for the swap go out.

Tip: If you absolutely want to be notified when the swap happens, go in the discord chat and type *news which should apply a role that gets a notification any time we post v2 updates.

Q) How will you ensure that network fees remain reasonable with only two decimal places?

The minimum network fees for transactions will be 0.01 TRTL. That’s the minimum amount that a fee can be without being 0 (free). Beyond that, we have ran the numbers to ensure that the majority of transactions fall within the range of the minimum network transaction fee (0.01). This is driven by the mechanics behind the fee-per-byte mechanism that calculates the required network transaction fee. Given that we know how large each part of a transaction is (in bytes) and how big signatures, proofs, etc. are we are able to arrive at a reasonable base chunk size that accounts for the majority of “normal” transactions.

Q) What will be the actual fee per byte (KB or MB)?

As it stands today, each chunk of 256 bytes (0.25KB), rounded up, will cost 0.01 TRTL; however, the first 10 chunks (2,560 bytes — 2KB) are included in the base network fee of 0.01 (to permit the majority of “normal” transactions to enjoy the minimum network transaction fee). This means that if your transaction is 2,561 bytes the network transaction fee will be 0.02 TRTL (before any PoW discounts) and a transaction of 2,000 bytes will be 0.01.

If, for instance, your transaction was 9,172 bytes, you can quickly calculate the base network transaction fee (before any PoW discounts) as 9,172 – 2,560 = 6,612 (bytes that are in excess of the “free” zone). 6612 / 256 = ~25.828 (rounded up) = 26. Therefore you’ll pay 0.01 (the base) + 0.26 (the chunk cost above the base) = 0.27 TRTL total.

Note: The actual chunk sizes may be tweaked during the Testnet runs of v2 before it launches by the general process will remain the same. After all, it’s worked quite well for v1 and has greatly curbed the amount of spam and junk transactions that enter the chain.